This transcript has been lightly edited for readability. It may still contain transcription errors.
James: Hello, and welcome to Graduate Theory. I met today’s guest a number of years ago at the university. He’s a very, very interesting young man. He was the president of the 180 degrees consulting branch based at other university. And he’s now. Graduated consultant at Deloitte in Adelaide. Please. Welcome to the show today, Alex, on their porch.
Alex: That’s going to be on the show. Thanks for having me on I’m graduate analyst, not graduate consultant, just because it’s a bit right.
James: Okay. Sure.
Alex: Um, yeah. Cool. Yeah,
James: Very nice. Well let’s, um, I’d love to dive into did Alex about your autonomy and invested obviously with each other for a while, but to give the audience a bit of a background about what, about what you did at university and, and that time, um, particularly I want to discuss your time at, at 180.
Um, cause I think that is, for me, it was a fantastic experience. In terms of preparing myself for work and getting a good, good exposure to the way things similar to the way things work in real life, rather than just the normal university project. But one thing I do want to ask you first, before we get into all of that is, you know, what did you study at university and how, how did you end up deciding to study that?
Alex: Um, well I studied bachelor of commerce, majoring in international business, and I chose that pretty much through a process of elimination. Um, and that’s because I didn’t, I knew I didn’t want to do raw accounting or finance because my math skills weren’t incredible, um, at that stage. So that’s sort of developed over the years, but definitely wasn’t something I wanted to do specifically for a career.
Um, and then marketing was something that I found interesting, but again, it wasn’t something I wanted to do for a career. Um, and then management is good, but it’s not something I think that is useful to study. If you want to work for someone. Um, because not a lot of people are going to hire graduates straight out of university to manage something.
They want to have them with a few years of experience, uh, pretty much just left international business. So, um, yeah, and it was good cause it was quite a generalist field as well. So it’s a bit of more, a bit of economics and a bit of finance with accounting. And then, um, I did pretty much a minor in management as well.
Yeah.
James: Yeah. Cool. Cool. I think that’s, that’s great. I think that’s a good way to do it if you will working out what to study, but it would take you in your, at any stage. It’s like, let’s first get rid of the things you don’t want to do or things that don’t fit. Um, and then from there, decide what you want to do something that’s good now did on that to get, you know, something that you are really interested in.
Um, Talking about like your, your experiences at university and things that you did. Um, obviously like 180 was a big part of your university career through the early and especially later stages. Um, was that the only thing that you’re into or did you explore a number of university, um, extracurricular activities through your time there?
Alex: And what I was definitely the main thing that has involved in at uni. Um, I did a couple feet get involved in a couple other clubs to a small degree, but not very much, um, just cause it wasn’t quite as rewarding as what I could get at 180. And so I got a bit of experience around some political clubs, just because I wanted to have a bit of an understanding about what was going on, that sort of, um, you know, what is democracy and all that sort of stuff and how it all works.
And. Business standpoint, it’s bit just to understand the two parties a bit. Um, so I got a little bit involved in that, but not too much. Um, and then a bit in all the generic, you know, business students, society, and, um, engineers, engineers, students, society for, um, or the pub crawls and that, so, yeah. Yeah, one idea was definitely the main thing.
Yes.
James: Wait, that’s where they go. And what for the viewers who don’t know what 180 actually is, could you give us a bit of insight and set while they do and how to ex
Alex: Yeah, absolutely. Um, so 180 degrees consulting is a student led volunteer consulting, um, organization. So it’s, it’s global and it’s run through universities.
Um, and it’s pretty much just getting some of the top talent. So I think opera and fed properly. 20% acceptance rate and stuff like that. And then only about 25% of the branches who applied to start actually yet through. So it’s, I’m trying to get that the university talent who really want to do really want to get some experience and hands-on experience working with clients and then marry that up by helping not-for-profits.
So you just need some really cheap or pro bono consulting advice to sort of become more efficient and effective with what. Yeah, just get students who want a bit of experience and get them to help charities and get people a bit of social impact leadership, but in students as well, so that when they go into the workforce, they are a bit more conscious of having a community impact rather than just, um, getting to a job and working.
So.
James: Yeah, no, I think that’s great. Like the whole club and, you know, your experience in my experience too, it’s just really cool match between uni students that really have the skills to get to do something cool, but don’t really have the opportunity to, and then also those, you know, non-profits or smaller companies that have, you know, something they want to do, but they can’t afford, you know, cranium or to pay like the dollars for some concerns.
So I think it’s, you know, it was really a fantastic operation, scary for both of us to be able to do that and learn those skills as we were going through uni. Um, what would you say, like for yourself, your, how long have you, were you involved in there and, and what were, what was really some of the main benefits that you got
Alex: From being involved?
Um, so I’ve started in 2017, I think. And then I did that all the way through to the end of day. Um, in 2019. And then again, when I did my post-grad, I was involved as well. I’m quite lucky to be involved in that through 2020 as well. So, um, yeah. And then I’m now in the global leadership teams also, still, still involve just different capacity.
Um, I’m also sick publications.
James: Oh, w what were some of the main things that you, you know, some of the main things that you’ve like picked up, or like all of the main benefits that you get out of it? Cause you’re still involved at the moment. So what keeps
Alex: You involved? Uh, well, what keeps me involved as being able to have that social impact component, because that’s why I originally started.
Oh, why I originally applied is because I wanted to, I wanted to get some sort of volunteering throughout uni just to sort of have that social thing. Um, people in the community, but it was always trying to find something that, cause it was a bit of a trade-off between being able to volunteer and have that community impact, but also knowing that you have to get a lot of work experience in order to get a job.
Um, and sometimes it had to be, you have to pick one or the other. Um, so I’ve been involved for that reason. So that was one of the that’s pretty much the thing that keeps me involved at the moment is having that impact, um, or at least having the opportunity to create some sort of. Um, and the things I’ve learned was sort of like soft skills.
So communication, and then the big things is working with clients because at university you can try as much as you, as you want to get involved in a case study, but it’s still okay. Study. It’s not a live client experience with the project. And that was probably one of the main things I learned and is useful today in, um, risk advisory.
Um, another thing was taking. So one thing that I learned, which is a bit difficult to do at uni, because when you’re doing projects with teams, it’s very difficult to sort of get everyone to work together. And there’s always some people who don’t really want to be there and stuff. So, um, in one Addie, everyone wants to be there and they’re really trying, and they’re all pretty good at what they do as well.
Um, so you can get a quite diverse team from engineers, I think was a medical student. They now as well with. Um, maths, computer science, law, all the different sorts of business students, you can get, um, some philosophy and MBA. So it’s a really diverse cohort. So it’s working in the team and then learning how they solve problems.
Um, and that was something that was really good to learn. Um, especially at an early point in trying to get a job is how important diversity is and teams. Um, just because it’s yeah, from a consulting stance. Um, what you study isn’t necessarily important. It’s the way you solve problems. So if you’re studying engineering, you’re going to have a more structured way to solving problems than an art student.
Who’s going to be a bit more qualitative, so they might do like a big brainstorming. Um, they might do a big whiteboard session, whereas engineers might sit down and just come up with criteria to go through and solve problems. Um, so that was really good to learn. Um, and then, yeah, just PowerPoint and all the sort of technical stuff and how to do that is really good because it makes you feel a bit more efficient.
So you can get a lot more of the same work done in a shorter amount of time when you do get to your job, which is important, it gives you a bit more time back after United. Yeah.
James: Yeah, that’s really cool. I think that those skills, yeah, there’s so much mentioned there, but I think so much like, well, it’s such a good opportunity really, for someone that’s at university to gain all these skills, which typically like you were saying earlier, you really cannot.
Some, one of the main ways is the black flyer, an internship or some kind of experience like that. We can get these skills, but having, being able to match that with. Giving back to the community and like being involved with the university is, is really unique and something that certainly is so valuable getting those skills, like you were saying, communicating with clients in a real life situation.
That’s not like, um, you know, some case study from 30 years ago, um, it’s something, that’s something that’s like super key and super important. Absolutely. Would have prepared you well, um, for what you’re doing.
Alex: Yeah, exactly. And on that point about the case studies being about 30 years old, that is pretty accurate.
They’re always about five to 10, maybe. Yeah. Even 30 years old when they finally do make their way through, um, testing to get into, um, lectures and whatnot. So when you worked in client work, you’re actually working on current business problems for not not-for-profits. Um, and one really unique challenge about not-for-profit sector is the lack of resourcing, either financial or people.
So it’s being able to solve problems with very limited resources on the client side. Um, normally sometimes you might even have just one or two people that are running a charity and everyone else is just volunteering when they can. So there’s no set staffing or anything like that either. Um, it’s really cool to be able to work on that.
Um, it’s such a difficult sort of climate, um, sort of helps you get a bit more creative,
James: So yeah. Yeah. Yeah, spot on. Um, one thing I want to dive into next is about your life. You’re involved in it. You’re still involved with the club, but definitely in the early days you started as a junior consultant or whatever, you know, start at the bottom end and you worked your way up to becoming the president, basically running the whole club.
Um, I wouldn’t to talk about that journey itself and about. Growing those skills from becoming someone that was really sort of taking orders to someone that was giving orders to everyone. Um, you know, what was that transition like for you and how did you go about like growing that skillset? Because it is quite, it’s something that can be difficult where you go from, you know, being told what to do versus having to be a bit more creative and set the direction.
And tell people what to do. How do you go about learning, how to do that? Was that something that you just kind of spoke to people about or yeah. What was your process for doing that?
Alex: Yeah, so a bit of it is a bit of, um, self-learning so you have to go through and reading Harvard business review articles, and just trying to find anything that’s out there about how to do he could shop pretty much.
Um, but he had just trying to stay one step ahead and just like, if you’re genuinely really interested in stepping up. And kept taking a more responsibility than Donald. Just be something that he can read and research in your own free time. And I won’t really feel like you’re doing any work for it. Cause it’s just interesting.
Um, but then another really big component is having someone who’s more senior than you want me to take over their role. Um, and in what 80, it’s quite a unique sort of spear and it’s the same sort of thing with, um, university clubs as if I only got about a year in a role. And then you move on. So, no one’s really going to try and block you from moving up.
Everyone wants you to move up. So you’ve got a lot of the people. So when I was a junior consultant, there were the senior consultants, project leaders and executive who were just always encouraging people to move up. Um, so it was very easy to get some advice or, um, get some feedback or just dowel generally just direct people and go, this is something you need to do.
Um, so getting that feedback from people is really good. Um, and just being a bit open-minded to have. Critical critical. Feedbacking, it’s sometimes difficult to hear, but it’s really important to be able to hear it and then take that on board and make changes. And then yeah, step up a little bit and yeah, just repeat that process as you keep going up because he just needed, everything’s a constant learning, learning curve.
Yeah.
James: Yeah. For sure. With the, you mentioned there like, you know, Harvard business, the articles and things like that, what sort of places do you go to get, uh, your information from? Because so many people get them from so many different places and that’s one area that’s like, like I’m fantastic resource.
Where else do you go to get that kind of information?
Alex: That’s a good question, because it is difficult to sort of pick your, your resources and the way you find the information, because especially today’s world, anyone can publish anything they want online. So it’s, it’s difficult to sort of sift through all of that.
Um, but with career advice sort of stuff, I’d always go to McKinsey or BCG or Deloitte or anything like that and see what they’ve got published. Cause they have their own little research wings or people who are senior. Just follow those senior leadership that the people in senior leadership, um, and you can sort of pick up some stuff from them who are happy to sort of put out that information publicly and go, this is what I’m doing and you can sort of go, okay, I like this idea and I like this idea, but I don’t really like that.
I think it sort of builds your own leadership style as you progress and based on what those leaders are doing. Um, and then yeah, stuff like Harvard business review, and then, um, there’s a whole bunch of different professional. Organizations like the governance Institute of Australia at the Institute of internal auditors, which is something for my field.
That’s important, um, to sort of look or get a bit of information from each different career path has their own sort of organization. That’s set up to develop people in that field. And so they really good places to start. And then you can branch out from there. And that’s something that he doesn’t push too much is the little professional development organizations, or I say a little bit, they’re quite massive.
And some of them are global as well. So, um, yeah, that’s a bit of something that’s lacking from uni is just not really having that pushed as much as I think it should be. Um, just to at least look at them, not necessarily join them because there is a financial component to that, but, um, yeah, just at least looking at them, they’ve got a lot of free resources that are useful.
So.
James: Yeah, spot on. I think, I think you’d like developing yourself in these kind of soft skills is something that. Can be more difficult because there’s not really like, it’s, it can be harder to like, you know, improve your ability to take some feedback or something like that. Or like give feedback, for example.
Yeah. Like these things are quiet, you know, they’re not very tangible things. So it’s can be difficult to say, like, if you’re doing them better or worse than you worked previously, I think that makes it even more important to, for that to be something that’s a focus and something that you really. You know, pay attention to when you seek advice and seek these resources to improve, um, cause they can really, you know, the benefit yourself and your career in so many ways, if you can get good at these kinds of soft skills, definitely that’s something that, that you’ve found like as you’ve grown these skills that it’s really helped, um, in, in other areas of your
Alex: Career.
Yeah, absolutely. I think soft skills are sort of the reason that people get. Um, there’s some careers that are definitely exceptions to the rule where it’s definitely exceptions. So for example, investment banking and consulting, you have to have very good technical skills to get a job there. Um, but if you don’t, it’s just, you’re not going to get hired.
This is that simple. Um, but in some of the slightly less intense fields. So for example, with risk advisory, with timing and internal audit, um, It’s really important to be able to fit into the culture of the team that you’re going to work with. Um, so the soft skills are quite important and especially with client facing work, um, and then the technical skills are just almost to help yourself more than they are to help the organization.
Um, so if you’re really good with Excel and PowerPoint, then that’ll make it easier for you to do your job. You’ll be a lot more efficient and you’ll be able to. I either to take on more work and step up and get more responsibility faster, or you’ll just be able to get your work done slightly faster and, uh, meet all the deadlines and make sure that you’re not the reason that a projects lagging behind or, um, you might be able to help your manager or someone on another project, or even just some of the other graduates, um, but some of their work as well.
So then you can take that leadership role with some of the undergraduates without really having to do. Oh, I’m try to force it to happen so you can just sort of yeah. All help each other and then build each other up because everyone’s someone else is going to have something out that they know how to do that you don’t necessarily know how to do so then it’s good to be able to contribute.
James: So, yeah. Yeah, definitely. That’s yeah, I like that a lot. I know one thing you were saying, um, you, you were kind of talking about that briefly was, you know, people that, you know, can comment. Oh, the, with what they’re doing. Um, one thing I really want to ask you about is like the amount of graduates that you’ve seen through your involvement with the university with, with 180, what are some key things?
Okay. You know, traits even that you’ve seen in people that end up, you know, succeeding in that kind of environment versus the people that kind of. Yeah, they kind of stumble, um, or they can say they’re not really cut out for, in a way that you’d like, or, or in a way that, you know, th you know, there’s clearly like, sort of an, a, to B class of people in a lot of ways.
Um, so what is the, if you were going to say there’s two classes, let’s say we’re going to pick classes. The better, you know, what is the traits that you know that they have in?
Alex: Yeah, let’s start with that. Yeah. Well, I think it depends on what the definition of success is. I don’t know how to live a quick look beforehand and Google defines it as the accomplish accomplishment of an aim or purpose and Cambridge as the achievement of desired results.
And they’re pretty, pretty broad definitions. Um, whereas we typically think of success as like. There’s a definite financial component. There’s a social economic status where, um, you’re, you know, the classic partner at a big four firms sort of thing. Um, but it really depends on what each person defines as their own personal success and what that aim or desired result is for that person.
Um, and that is probably the main thing that would make someone fall into a typically good or typically bad category for that as a consultant is because. What they think has success. Won’t be to be a very good consultant. It might be that they’re spending more time with their family or that they’ve got better grades.
Um, so that really is what would be the difference between a good consultant at 180 in someone who might be as much of a high performer is just because their focus isn’t on that task. The focus was on something else. Um, and that’s the only reason they haven’t sourced people. Um, either leave or feel like they will.
Going to be doing well or sometimes the poor performance as well. It’s just that they weren’t applying themselves to 180 as much as they were to something else. Um, and it’s not necessarily, and they definitely weren’t bad. They were very good at what they did. They just didn’t have that time spare to, I find a 180 and that’s just sort of the, the challenge of conduits is to spend your time and make that decision with the best available information as to where you want to spend your.
Um, cause I think there’s something called like Parkinson’s law, whereas like work expands. So as to fill the time available for its completion. So if you’re giving yourself one week to do an assignment, you’ll take a week to do an assignment. And if you’re giving yourself one hour to do 180, then you’ll only, you know, you might be really good with that hour.
You might be really bad at that house. So, um, yeah, but some of the typical, um, sort of traits that are find with people who are good and did apply themselves. Um, was obviously, yeah, they applied themselves and they both wanted to, and did try to actively try to learn new things. Um, so they weren’t sort of stagnating though, constantly asking questions and asking for that feedback about how can they do better, what are some tools they can use to perform better?
Um, is there anything they can research and look at in their spare time to help be better at 180 and be a better consultant? And that’s when we can sort of steer them to certain, um, organizations. And YouTube channels and stuff. Um, they work well with other people regardless of whether or not they’re similar or not.
So, um, it might be the typical challenge of a law student and a business student where they’ve just got different ways of thinking, and they’re not really going wait together. Or I’m an art student against an engineering student where they’re both almost polar opposites in terms of hard skill and soft skills sort of work.
So, um, working well with other people regardless of their background is really important. And that sort of set people apart. Because we can’t work well as a team, then it’s sort of difficult to progress up in a leadership team with the team being the operative word, because especially in the client management, it’s, everyone’s sort of doing it in their spare time.
So you need to work with each other to manage it. You can’t do it all by yourself. So, um, as the president, I had it, I was very lucky to have a good one. Behind me as well to help support and that’s that leadership of the prompts as a whole, but everyone has their own different child, but it was sort of just, my job was to enable them to be able to be better at their job.
Um, rather than me trying to do everything myself as a maniac. Um, and then there’s always the classic, you know, be professional dress appropriately within your own style. So what we’re seeing is a lot of organizations it’s removing dress code policy. Um, Deloitte is even gone as far as to remove working hours.
So you can work as long as you work. It’s done within the week and you’re not, um, leaving your team with too much other stuff to do then. Um, yeah, you can work whatever hours he wants to, some people start at six and finish at three. So they have more time after school where their kids, um, and some people start later because they’re just not really functioning in the morning.
So they might start at 10 and finish a bit later in the evening. Cause that’s just works for them. Um, yeah, just be well presented within your personal style. Um, and there is a sort of line that needs to be followed as well within consulting and, you know, just don’t rock up in a t-shirt unless you’ve got a client that only wears t-shirts sort of thing.
And then yet again, this last things as they like working with clients and like solving problems, um, which sort of goes to do what you love and you’ll never work attain your life. So, yeah, which is a bit dry, but I think.
James: Yeah. Yeah. Well, there’s many like good, good tips in there. Um, you know, or things to kind of looked if you were going to go and say, okay, I want to really develop myself in this area.
And many of those skills, um, great things to kind of focus on. I’m gonna, you know, improve, improve this or improve that. I think that’s. Th there was so much good stuff in that. So I really liked that particularly one thing that you said then about, you know, what it means to be successful and really the definition, I think you said something like, you know, achieving the thing that you wanted or like, you know, doing, doing what you wanted or, you know, setting a goal and achieving it or something like that.
Um, I think that. It’s really important and something that even for myself, that, and kind of lose track of that in a way, but he kind of gets sucked into this thing where like, success means like I have to make this much money and like have a nice car and live in a nice big house and all that kind of stuff, but really it’s just having something that you want to do and doing it.
And
Alex: That’s it. Thank you so much more than that. Um, so yeah, the hook up was really. Hmm. I mean, there’s definitely a lot there as well, and it’s definitely not. You have a person doesn’t have to do all of this at the same time. It’s those are some traits that I found that were good within them. And that varying degrees to each, for each trait, as well as it’s not like one person has a hundred percent good skills, every single one of those things that sort of they’d have varying degrees of that.
And they’re the typical traits maybe across maybe 50 people that the common traits within those 50 people that were doing well, we’d all have. Um, yeah, between the 50, not all of them at once. Just sorta clarify the other way, just in case someone’s going to try and make sure that they get the perfect model with all those traits.
James: Yeah. Yeah. And I think that, like, that goes to what you’re saying too, about what you were saying about the work hours and how, you know, you can choose your work hours, but supporting that within your personal style is to present yourself well and still do the best you can. So, and then, uh, you know, if you accept like that, you got to do things a certain way, as long as you’re, you know, you’re.
You know, putting itself in a good light and doing, going about things in the right way and, you know, having good communication skills or whatever it is within that, then nothing that’s.
Alex: And I think mostly there’s a pretty, um, sensitive to that as well, where they know that the people who they’re trying to lead won’t be perfect.
And they’re not expecting that either. It’s just, if they can see someone really trying and putting in their best effort and there’ll be a lot more likely to help them than someone who’s not trying to. At least that’s something I’m very happy to do as if I can see someone really trying to do well, but I’ll happily put a bit of time aside to help them with problems or give them a bit of a device, or even if they do.
Talk out loud with someone and they solve their own problems. It’s just, if someone’s really trying, then I think a lot more, a lot of leaders are very happy to give them time, um, if they want it. So, yeah.
James: Yeah. I agree. That’s, that’s definitely been my experience, like in, at what I may as well, like, uh, leaders who are around, um, you know, you were interested in learning and growing then certainly almost everyone.
Yeah. Really keen to help you and take you, help you get to wherever it is that you want to go. Now, it’s just a matter of, of asking and putting that out there. And I don’t think something that you sit back all of, of wanting to achieve something and then, you know, and then going in that direction, that’s all it takes.
And then this plenty of support there. And in most cases, um, For that stuff to happen, which I think is enormously beneficial for someone that’s going to go down whatever path it is. But seeking that advice from someone that’s, you know, 1, 2, 3 steps ahead. Um, it’s it’s like
Alex: Enormously beneficial. Yes, exactly.
They’ve been there, done that. And, um, that’s the thing. We’re all people, we’re all human they’ve started in the same spot. So they would have faced the similar, like similar sort of challenge. Um, so they more than likely have solved that problem. And then can just give you a quick fix solution, um, or just can tips on how to solve it for you for.
Let’s get you to just ask the questions.
James: Yeah, definitely. Yeah. I think that’s, that’s super cool. And one thing maybe on that, on that, on that topic, let’s say is, you know, setting a goal and achieving it was becoming the president of 180 and being where you are now, something that you always had in mind, or is that something that you just.
Like full and into almost as time has gone on. And you’ve said like, yes, to like, you know, the next step without having that broader vision, or do you always have that in mind that this was a clear thing you want to go and you’re quite methodical about where it was that you wanted to go?
Alex: Um, well, that’s definitely a good question. I think it’s something I definitely had on a to-do list or anything. It’s not something I really thought that I’d ever achieve either. It’s just. When I start something, I like to see how far I can get within it and what I can learn from it. So 180 was definitely something from that where I started with the social impact side of stuff.
And then while I was in it, it was like, cool. I can definitely learn a lot from this and just wanted to see how much I could learn. And then, um, just got progressed as people left the organization or, um, there were vacancies, so it just sort of applied or got asked to step up and do that sort of stuff. So, um, you know, sort of a natural progression.
Um, I definitely wasn’t trying for what I definitely very much appreciated being given the opportunities to step up. Um, yeah, yeah. Mostly just right place, right time. And yeah, good people ahead of me that wanted to see me succeed and sort of give me that extra responsibility
to that is something I do enjoy is sorry. Um, Um, yeah, it’s definitely something I do enjoy as it’s being able to take on a bit more responsibility for things that I enjoy doing. So one idea was definitely part of, I was just, yeah, just trying to take on more responsibility and way more things. And the role progression just came with that.
James: Yeah. I like that. I think you’re spot on there and I think that speaks to something too. It is like, you know, the people you’re around in the organization you’re in is so important to getting. You know those opportunities to grow your career. Um, you know, and it’s something like, like w you know, 180 in that environment, it’s like, you’ve mentioned, it’s really encouraging that people are really encouraging to, you know, want to take you to the next step.
And I think whether it’s the, at this university club or whether it’s in your career, it could be anywhere. Um, but you had that environment where people are constantly looking for ways to take that. Um, to the next level is something that’s, you know, something that’s really cool, um, to be able to offer you more responsibility, more opportunities, I think, um, you know, growth and admiring it, all that kind of stuff is so important in, you know, in any position that anyone can be really, um, you know, learning and growing is, is really almost what lots about.
So, um, yeah, having those opportunities. Is that super important and no doubt, like you kind of reap the rewards of that too, when you go and let people, um, you know, take advantage of those resources and grow themselves, uh, it’s better for both the organization and, um, of the individuals. So
Alex: Yeah, that’s really, you get out of life and you get out of the things, what you’ve put into it.
So if you put a lot of effort in the neck and energetic and a lot of heck going to get a lot of rewarding, Um, if you put a minimal amount of effort, you’re not going to get a lot of reward out of it. So
James: Yeah. I get out what you put in spot on there. Exactly. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I think great example of that, I think certainly applies to many
things. Yeah. So yeah, I think that’s a good, that’s great advice. Um, one other topic I want to ask you about too, outside of. Yeah, you were you’re at Deloitte at the moment. I want to talk about your, uh, you know, how you ended up there from university and what that kind of transition was like into, into your job.
And how did you actually do that? Did you apply for like, like mine and my personal approach? I just kind of pushed out heaps of I’m sure this is very common where it’s kind of like your last year of uni find like any sort of company that sounds all right. Boom and smashed them into everywhere. Um, was that your approach if we’re getting the job where you are today or how, what was your kind of transition line from the end of
Alex: University?
Um, more originally applied to Deloitte, just not thinking of actually get any sort of author or anything. It was just sort of, it’s interesting. And, um, thought it might be cool and to see how far I get with it as well. Um, but I originally sort of only applied, so maybe one or two companies at a time. Well research that men figure out where I think I could work well and where I’d enjoy working.
Um, so it’s definitely a bit, I think I’m more of the minority of people who definitely don’t apply it, use the shotgun method and just apply it to everything. Cause it’s, it’s got results. I mean, one of my friends applied to, I think almost every law firm in the country and he’s got offers from the top three and the top six as well, different city, different cities.
So it definitely works for. Yeah. And I took that approach the second time around when I was applying for grad roles. And when I applied to a couple of different ones, and that was on the advice of my mentor from my coach, from the vacation program, at the loop and where it was just apply to other firms.
And then you’ve got a bit more of an option. And I think some of the bigger firms appreciate being able to have consult graduates who have multiple. Um, and make someone who has applied to different organizations, make it a bit more competitive on the hiring side. So they have to really try to get you to come on board rather than if you’re, you’ve only applied to that one firm and sort of, if they don’t want you, then you’re done, then if they want you, then it doesn’t feel like they really winning in that regard.
Um, it doesn’t really feel like they’re succeeding in bringing someone across. Seizing that top talent. It’s sort of just, um, there’s one person then if we can take them, if you want to say, I definitely prefer the apply everywhere sort of thing, and then you can learn different stuff and it sort of goes to the fail fast sort of methodology, where if you apply to a bunch of places in your second to last year on your last year, um, you can learn a lot about being interviewed and sort of a lot about yourself.
Um, when you’re going through all those assessment centers and, um, all the online testing and the interviews and stuff it’s failing early and learning more about yourself as you go, and then you can sort of narrow your target or your application focus to south view. Thank you. Like, based on that interviewing experience.
Um, so yeah, I did more of a single firm application process. But it sort of wiped out in the end, but yeah, I think applying to a lot of other places is beneficial.
James: Yeah. No, I think that’s cool. I think, I think, um, you know, regardless of whether you’re going from university into a career, or even if you’re mid career going into it, you know, you’re looking for another job, I think, you know, Lackey said.
Um, yeah. Applied for multiple different roles and having that, you know, being out of practices skills, being able to share it, you have multiple offers, um, is, is something that’s like Mexico. Good. And it’s also, yeah. Um, and obviously also, like in terms of, um, you know, applying, like getting different opportunities and stuff, it’s, it is helpful to have that confidence.
If this doesn’t
Alex: Work out, then I have this or whatever. Um,
James: So yeah, I think I liked that a lot in other, uh, your experience is great too. Um, yeah, I like it a lot. I think w like, how have you found the transition from, you know, being involved in this university clubs and having those things in university to.
Now you’re in your head, in a job, you’re doing things, you know, not to bother or whatever. Um, how do you find that transition? Do you think it’s on you to that bestie and your involvement with clubs and things like that? It has prepared you well
Alex: For what you’re doing now. I think it should be quite well.
And that sort of goes back to the Parkinson’s law before where it’s saying, if you give yourself a limited amount of time or a year, it’s up along the amount of time, you’ll take that. The amount of time you say is the amount of time it would take to do the. Um, and that’s probably one of the main things that I can apply within a nine to five, working on several projects at a time is, um, just not having that free time to procrastinate.
Um, it’s not like you’ve got any insane time management tips or anything or tricks, or you’ve got a spreadsheet with all the different things you’re doing. It’s just simply, you’ve done a lot of stuff through uni. So it’s like, you know, working part time studying. Facing grades and then also doing clubs and extracurriculars, and then trying to be fit and healthy as well.
At the same time. Um, limiting the amount of time you have to do tasks is probably a really good way to prepare for uni. And that’s where the extra curriculars come in handy. And we only have such a limited amount of time to do them. And then you start getting used to being more efficient with your. Um, so that’s, what’s being really useful going into the nine to five.
So you can actually finish at five o’clock because you’ve got your tasks done because that’s, you know, that’s the cutoff. So it’s, it’s sort of a bit strange leaving a before and then we’re entering into a big four life. And then, um, being able to leave at five, it feels a bit wrong, almost considering all the, um, the jokes and the memes and everything.
It sort of feels almost. It’s um, yeah, if you can be efficient with your time and you’ve got a good team and they don’t assign you too much work, then, um, yeah, that’s been a really good, uh, that translates almost directly to, through working life. Um, I found, um, and that was also the teamwork component as well.
So doing the extracurricular and especially with 180, learn how a project team functions and you start learning the big picture about how projects. So, if you understand the pre project phase, the, the working phase, the post-project phase, and then actually sourcing clients, and then how it all works as a directorship position where you need projects to work well, then managing client relations.
So when you’re entering in as a graduate understanding what your boss does and what your bosses boss does, it means that you can better support them, which ultimately is your job as a graduate as to make your senior’s lives. Yeah. Um, cause you’ve just typically got more free time and they might have families or they’ve just got there.
They will have a much larger workload as well. Um, so you’re understanding how it all fits together in a big picture, sort of high-level position helps a lot. Um, and it would make, it sort of helps you perform a bit better and Mexican makes your boss like you. So yeah. Things it’s just not having is just being efficient with your time and understanding the big picture of your job.
James: Hmm. Yeah, I think that’s cool. But I think the time efficiencies while even while you’re saying that I’m like my head’s going off, all these things I can be doing to like, you know, use my time more effectively, uh, you know, especially when you’re at work and you got certain amount of things to do everything out of squeeze that in is something.
You know, valuable for yourself, because if you’re using your time better than, you know, it means you’ve got more time to do, you know, you can finish out five walk, go do other stuff after work, and it just
Alex: Brings you up a lot more. So I think that’s a great skill to improve on and to grow. Yeah. And then, um, project work it’s time is quite literally money.
So if you spend too much time doing tasks, You ended up blowing out the budget and the project ends up almost being a failure because you’ve, you’ve gone over budget or you’ve gone over deadlines. So yeah, it’s really important to be efficient with your time or otherwise you might end up doing a bit of work for free sort of thing.
So, yeah, yeah,
James: Yeah. You’re spot on there. All right. I liked that. Um, one thing I, I do want to, to finish with now is let’s say you have. Starting university again, you know that you’ve added those experiences with your degree 180. Now you’ve done all these amazing things through your whole time. Um, yeah.
What is one piece of advice that you’d give someone starting university? Let’s say it started next year.
Alex: Um, I think because you’ve spent five years at union as well. Cause I’ve, I’ve done about five years at uni as well at the age of two. Yeah. So I think that’s probably one of the things I’ve learned more than anything is that, I mean, a career your whole lifetime and career is about 40, 50, 60 years of work.
And at some little thing that often gets left out when you’re doing the, um, success talk is there’s a lot of pressure to succeed at a very early age. And so it’s sort of, you know, if you, I mean, I’m 24 now and I’m just starting as a graduate, only being there for three months. I still feel like I’m relatively young in the whole careers, Korea side of stuff.
It’s still got so much to learn, but there’s a lot of pressure to succeed. The typical definition of like, you know, um, social status and wealth and stuff at an early age. So, um, I just, the, the piece of advice would be really just to take your time. There’s absolutely no rush. Um, if he’s still getting into a decent job or getting into the workplace that you want to work at, or.
The organization or the job that you want to work in, um, before you’re 30, I think that’s still a really good achievement. Um, some people might not actually have a Kevin to the job they liked. So it says, take the time, learn some skills and just be easy on yourself because you’ve got 40, 50 years to work.
So you might as well enjoy the 20, enjoy your twenties while he can.
James: Yeah. Yeah. You’re spot on. That is so key and something that’s really common. Yeah. Through speaking to you today, it’s like, let’s just take the pressure off. Let’s just chill out a bit, take our time. And then from that, from there, now let’s go, you know, at that time now, from, from this kind of more of a relaxed, you know, less stress kind of place, let’s go on and do the things that we want rather than putting pressure on yourself to say like, Yeah, I have to do this or like how to do that.
Um, or like, if I don’t get this job, then it comes to failure or things like that. It’s just not really not constructive at all. So I think, I think that’s great advice to take one second. Yeah.
Alex: Yeah, exactly. I think there was a quote. I can’t remember exactly what it is. I might be paraphrasing, but the, the enemy of happiness is comparison. And I think that’s very powerful in your twenties when you’re trying to be successful for whatever that is for yourself. And trying to compare yourself to people who are more senior or older or more advanced in their careers, or might have just had different circumstances leading up to that as well, because we’ve all got.
Um, personal lives and personal histories as well. So just do the best that each person can. And just try to just focus on what you’re doing and if you’ve improved from the previous year, then just be happy with that. Yeah.
James: Thanks. So, yeah, it’s been wonderful chatting with you today. Thanks so much for your time.
Alex: Okay. Um,
James: Bruce, before you go, if someone was looking to get in touch with you, maybe they’ve watched this and you think that you’re a cool dude. Um, what is the best way to get in touch with you?
Alex: Um, in terms of professional stuff, I’d probably just say LinkedIn, that’s probably the easiest way to go. My name is pretty unique, so it should be pretty easy.
Um, yeah, I think that’s probably the easiest way, so yeah, just send a message or, um, HR to connect or something like that. So,
James: Oh, thanks for coming on that much. Appreciate
Alex: It. And very good questions. Let me think of it.
James: Sweet.
Alex: Okay. Wrap it up now.